This may be an interesting post given that my readership, at least judging from the comments, is predominately male. That statistic is one that I’ve only recently become aware of, as I tend to view people as people regardless of gender (or sex), race or whatever. I recognize that there are gender or sex differences, just as I recognize cultural differences. These I think tend to make things interesting, but don’t affect my ability to converse about theology and all of the other things I love to discuss. In short, this introduction is more a disclaimer to my readers because I have experienced much support and recognition from my predominately male readership, and I don’t wish to make you feel as though the emotions I will be expressing are directed at you. I just need to get my thoughts and feelings into dialogue because that is how I process things and arrive at conclusions. In this process, I need both male and female friends because of how wonderfully different our thought processes can be. So often to solve a problem, we come at it from completely opposite angles, and yet this provides such clarity and depth to the solution if we can learn to reason together.
I’m struggling with varied emotions, many of them ranging toward anger… anger at the way things are, anger at feeling somewhat helpless to change them, anger that this is actually still an issue and I can’t simply focus on other theological pursuits without continuing to deal with this.
I am a woman. That’s one label I will gladly accept. I like being a woman. I don’t want to be a man.
When I shared some of the thoughts I am about to share with you with one of my guy friends, he said, “you sound like you’re becoming a feminist.” Maybe. I don’t really like that label. Why must my thoughts and others who share my thoughts be categorized under a label that has often been used to bring to mind images of some sort of militant agenda? Or some type of man-hater mindset? Why must there be such a revolution to realize that all people are equal regardless of sex, race, culture, skin color?
I know the answer. We live in a world that is inherently broken by sin and thus not the way that God intended it to be. We who use the label “Christian” ought to be leading the way in promoting steps that will take us back to the equality God intended for his children to live in, and yet in many cases we have been the ones not only standing for injustice, but justifying and promoting injustice by means of favorite proof texts.
This is damnable.
I don’t know if I can possibly get all my thoughts out in one blog post. But I’m going to do my best. I can’t possibly hope to write out all of the theological underpinnings of my thoughts in this post. Given what I know of my readers, I think that many of them will be aware of the various arguements, texts, and will have done much of this work on their own. I will provide a few books at the end of this post for people to consult, and if this is your first introduction to my blog, I would be happy to dialogue with you, or perhaps even post further posts with theological understandings of the main verses that have been used in this debate.
I am going to attempt to use a broad brush stroke that has been the start and remains the core of this journey that I am on. For the further I get into the field of theology, the more I realize that I am in a man’s world. The major theologians that we sit and discuss are men. Most writers of commentaries are men. That doesn’t mean that I think they have inherently misogynist viewpoints. I am merely making an observation as to quantity. I have been blessed by many a male commentary writer or seminary professor who have affirmed my calling and understanding of what it means to be a woman.
Now for the theological brushstroke. My understanding of the equality of women in both ministry and in relationships (extending to the marriage relationship) comes from the fall and redemption of humankind. It is in the fall that Eve is told that “your husband shall rule over you.” This is the curse, the condemnation, the result if you will of the fall. If the cross, then, is the redemption of the fall, should we not be looking for redeemed relationships? Relationships that actually personify this idea that in Christ there is no male nor female?
Should we not be leading the way in restoring what the fall has done to our ability to live fully human lives and to have fully human relationships?
If the cross of Christ is equally effective in redeeming men and women, then there are no differences in equality or in what positions of leadership that men and women can have. I am not knocking that there are differences in men and women. Any of my beach walks shows that there are ample differences as I pass people and hear snatches of their conversations. If it is two women walking, they are generally discussing men. If it is two men, they are generally discussing women.
And yet, I think that these great differences that we spend so much time trying to figure out were meant by God to be complimentary opposites and invoke a sense of mystery that continues to make us pursue eachother.
Our society however, despite that it is ahead of the church in many ways, is still not fully recognizing women. What? You might say, name a place that women aren’t. It’s not that so much as looking at the overall picture. Yes, women may be high powered executives, professors, politicians or whatever, but at what price?
Last week’s Newsweek carried an article about how women are having difficulty getting tenure track positions especially in math and science (See “Sex and Science,” Newsweek, Janyary 31, 2005, pp.36-38). The president of Harvard helped matter by declaring that perhaps women lacked the mental capacity to suceed in the sciences, a statment he later wrote an apology for, however, a politically corredt apology doesn’t do much when an underlying sentiment like that is exposed.
In reality, women’s biological clocks interfer with the tenure schedule, the article went on to point out. The primary years for research and publishing to secure one’s position are in your twenties and thirties, the same years that women have children. So it would seem that we are either asked to sacrifice having a family for career, or to sacrifice having a career for a family. This is some gratitude for being the ones to actually carry and deliver the next generation into the world. What man has ever made the choice between career and family? It is not asked of them.
This makes me angry for I want both a career and a family, and I want my husband to raise our kids just as much as I do. For in this dichotmy where the women end up staying home to raise their kids, the kids end up being raised by the mother, and not really by the father for the mother spends exponentially more time with the children than the father does. Some have noticed this and tried to use it as a rationale for keeping women in the house, because arguably, the task of raising the next generation is a noble one, and hence, while the roles of men and women are different and in different spheres, they are equal.
That is a bunch of… you fill in the blank. The word I’m thinking of Paul used and is translated for the more sensative ear as “dung.”
What that attitude actually promotes is absentee fathers, who, while they don’t actually abandon their familes, are not nearly as actively involved in them as their wives. Last time I checked, the Biblical injunctions were for the parents to raise their children, not for the mothers alone.
The other inequality of how our world works is what was expressed by my neighbor soon after she got married. She said something about how everyone knows that when people get married the woman’s workload around the house goes up. And she is a career woman. She and her husband both have careers, had their own houses, and married in their thirties. Why on earth should her work load go up because she gets married? If I have a roommate, my my workload doesn’t increase, and yet I am expected to then “take care” of my husband’s laundry, clean the house, all while having my own 40-plus hour-a-week job? And he gets to stop doing the things that he was doing before when he was single? This is equality??
The picture at the beginning of this post is from an article in this week’s Newsweek (”Mail-order Misery,” Newsweek, February 7, 2005, p 54). You can read it on the web for now here. The woman pictured was a mail-order bride from the Ukraine. The site she used was started by a woman, who connects American men with foreign wives, predominately from Eastern Europe, Southeast Asia and other econimcally depressed parts of the globe. The article says she “promises to connect clients with women who will ‘follow their husband’s lead…’” Presumably, as women have looked for equality, there are men out there who are still looking for the “little woman” who will take care of them, and live to “follow” them around.
A recent film, The Stepford Wives, dealt with this subject rather well. High-powered business women are converted into controllable housewives via technology because they threaten their husbands. The conclusion of the movie, however, points to the fact that real relationships are derived from love and trust and wanting the other to suceed without feeling threatened. Matthew Broderick (who plays Nicole Kidman’s husband) ends up realizing that all the things he loves about his wife would be lost if he attempt to mechanize her into someone who won’t threaten him.
Another exploration by Newsweek (I think I like this magazine!) into women today is carried in the online article, “Best Actress: Why doesn’t Hollywood care?“, about the upcoming Oscars. It noted that most of the time the women nominated for best actress are not in films nominated for best picture, while the majority of the men nominated for best actor are in the best picture films. The article noted in addition, that no no actress over 40 year years old has won best actress in the last 10 years. What does that say? Women are only valuable while they still have beauty appeal? That’s a slap in the face to someone like Annette Bening (pictured above in Being Julia).
And then of course, we have contributions from the Christian world, such as this statment on the Dallas Theological Seminary website: “While the Master of Theology degree is coeducational, the Seminary holds the position that Scripture limits to men the roles of elder and senior pastor in the local church. Therefore the Pastoral Leadership concentration of the Pastoral Ministries track is not open to women.” The Master of Theology degree is their version of the Master of Divinity degree. Further down on the page, under the description for the “Women’s Ministry” track, we find the following affirming statement:
“While Dallas Seminary holds the position that Scripture limits to men the roles of elder and senior pastor in the local church, it also affirms that local churches, denominational structures, parachurch organizations and ministries, educational institutions, and missions agencies all present many other strategic ministry opportunities for women. This track is designed to equip women to organize and lead women’s ministry programs in a variety of these settings.
The Women’s Ministry track is an interdisciplinary track under the oversight of the Christian Education department but with course options from several departments. Though the following courses make up the general requirements of the track, students may substitute other relevant courses, with the approval of the department, to tailor the track to meet their unique ministry goals.”
In other words, of course women can be in ministry so long as they stay in ministry to women and children.
I cite all of these examples that have come to my attention in the past week because they show that our society as a whole, and particularly the church, has a problem. This problem is reaffirmed as I search for a minsitry position and find that many positions are blocked to me because I am a women. Once I applied to one of these positions anyway because it sounded good, and I was hoping that the use of “we are looking for a man” was an antiquated gender-specific term that hadn’t been edited. I recieved a polite reply to my inquiry that because they were looking for “specific criteria,” I didn’t fit, and so I should look elsewhere. This was without ever meeting me, interviewing me or anything.
We ought to be leading the way in redemptive views of human beings, and claiming ignorance of the problems that still exist is no excuse.
(For further thoughts see “What does it mean to be a Woman: continuing thoughts“)
23 Comments
Anna, it is so encouraging to me to know that there are women out there (you especially) who are going before me. Your struggles at being accepted in a man’s world, particularly the “organized church” make the path of those who follow just a little easier. I love that you take pride in being the beautiful woman God created, and refuse to conform to the idea that you have to become as much like a man as you can to succeed. I’m just hoping that we won’t have to wait around for Jesus to get back before the rest of the world figures out that women can be feminine, and be mothers and wives and ministers. And to the guys out there reading this that support you, thank you for seeing the value God has placed on a life he has created for his own purposes.
A friend in Alaska once remarked about the prospect of remaining a single female in a state where women are outnumbered many times by men: “The odds are good but the goods are odd.”
Same goes with the professional ministry…we have complicated the Gospel to allow control and power by people rather than the leading of the Spirit. This aspect of the institutionalized church is rapidly losing steam and those in control want the status quo much more than the uncertainty of people actually following God rather than the religion.
Rather Pharisaical…who’s it all about? Jesus. What’s it all about? Building the Kingdom.
When tradition gets in the way of the true mission, it has become nostalgia and deserves its place on the shelf while the mission moves forward.
I will preface by saying that I am a man (so I guess you will have to take what I say with a grain of salt.)
A few thoughts:
1. Read the book Brain Sex (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0385311834) that came out several years ago. It very clearly shows that men and women do NOT think the same, react the same, process information the same, react to sensory stimuli the same…in short, we are not the same and our brains–one of the most fundamental parts of us–determines that lack of sameness.
2. On women in math fields–One of the most startling differences between men and women is that men are far more adept at handling 3D rotations of objects in space–a basic math skill. The standardized IQ test that was used for decades tested for aptitude in doing 3D rotations, but this spatial test was ultimately removed a few years ago because it resulted in across-the-board lowering of scores for women. Scientists for years used those lower scores as justification for claiming that women were not as intelligent as men–and all because of that one section of the test. Truth is, very few women do 3D rotations well and it is almost impossible to teach. In fact, men outscore women on almost every spatial test available besides the 3D rotation test. It is not a stretch then to say that if women do not do as well on spatial tests (and much of mathematics deals with spatial manipulations) that they are (generally) not as good as men at math.
This is not to imply that men don’t have deficiencies, too. Women are far better than men at processing auditory information. In theory, at least, women would make better sound engineers and technicians, but for some reason women are not beating down the doors to go into these fields–ones in which they would certainly excel.
3. On businesswomen and their careers–Several years ago, Jane Pauley on the TODAY Show had some top businesswomen on to discuss their careers. At one point, she asked this very illustrious panel of women if the sacrifices had been worth it. Expecting them to unanimously agree that it WAS worth it, Pauley was dumbstruck when one woman after another said, “No.” In fact, one woman started crying and talking about how she had forsaken having children in order to advance her career, but that had been a drastic mistake. Others agreed that the sacrifices had not been worth it. One woman even said she wished she’d followed in her mother’s footsteps and just stayed home. Another said she’d been sold a bill of goods by other women who insisted that she had to do this in order to make a point. Well, the point got made but this woman found it hadn’t been worth making. The cut to commercial came very abruptly and the panel was nowhere to be seen afterwards. It got a lot of press the next day. (I had actually watched that show myself, so I can attest that these confessions did indeed occur.)
For a lot of women, they got their careers and then decided it wasn’t worth what they had to give up to get them.
4. On older actresses–For years younger actresses complained that all the Oscars were going to actresses like Streep, Redgrave, Cher, and others in their late thirties to late forties. The call went out to honor younger actresses in order to convince a wave of new, young actresses that they could get into acting and win without waiting twenty years to do so. And that is exactly what happened. But now this is a BAD thing? Seems like they got what they were pushing for.
As for equating Best Actress with Best Picture roles, that’s the same story. The complaint was that good actresses were not being offered plum roles in “edgier” movies. Now some of the most talented actresses are taking those roles and being noticed for them (witness Swank, Theron, and Berry recently in three films that almost no one saw because the subject matter was “edgy.”
But most of the last twenty-five Best Picture winners have not been “edgy” films. They’ve been–if anything–very mainstream and seen by wide audiences.
Those are just a few thoughts. I hope they aren’t just passed over since they may not support some of the theories you stated above.
Blessings.
It is hard for me to know what to say here. Obviously, I can never know the full extent of your struggle from a man’s point a view. I will tell you that I struggle with the same issue from the other side of the equation.
My marriage has been quite different from that of my parents. While they both worked, my mom was still the homemaker. She made the dinner, did the dishes, and on and on. My dad took out the trash. I don’t think that he was necessarily lazy and I don’t think my mom necessarily felt oppressed. I confess that I’ve never asked her or even thought about it. It was just the way it was. And that is what I think you’re talking about here. I don’t consider your post feminist, but rather an attack on the status quo that has for too long been one-sided and narrow minded.
My wife and I both work full time. We have two kids and it is a juggling act. When the house gets crazy dirty I get mad. Not at my wife. Not at anything but the disorder. I don’t think I hold up my end of the deal enough of the time and I also get mad at that. I am trying, but I fail often. And like my father, I also have a son. He is watching my every move and taking notes. I am a role model literally modeling a role.
I grew up in a world where the men were Pastors and the women taught Sunday School. I now live in a world where I am a Music Director in a church and my sister in law is a Pastor. I, like her, and made in the image of God. When will that be enough for us? And I’m not just talking about men and women here.
I am sorry for the grief and anger that you bear. I hope that times are changing and I agree with you that more change needs to be made. I hope this is encouraging. Keep fighting. You were fearfully and wonderfully made and no jerk can take that away from you.
And by the way, I know of a church that is hiring. Interested?
Wow. I don’t think I’ve ever seen comments pour in so fast! Wonder why
Danielle and Jody, thanks for the encouraging words/thoughts.
Daniel, I’m going to respond briefly to your comments by number. But first, I don’t take comments with a grain of salt because of someone’s gender/sex. There are just as many women out there who subscribe to the viewpoints of the status quo as there are men. My post wasn’t intended as an attack on men, just on the way things are.
(1 and 2) I said in my post that we think differently. However, when women are graduating with PhD’s in math and the sciences and are making contributions, it implies that they can think that way. I don’t know about that study. I haven’t looked at it.
(3) I’m arguing that women have been asked to make sacrifices that men are not asked to make. No, it’s never worth sacrificing your family for your career, and men do it all the time. However, women are physically restricted because of pregnancy from doing their careers and this isn’t right. We need to make room for both men and women to raise their kids. Kids need both parents, not just stay-at-home moms.
(4) I’ll have to look at the history of the Oscars. I was merely quoting a Newsweek article. If what is current now is a reversal of an earlier excesss then perhaps things will right themselves on down the line. There could also be another factor in that we as a society tend to value youth more and more, but that’s another subject all together.
I don’t pass over views because they are contrary to mine. If my views were so easily threatened, they would not be worth having.
Brian, thanks. My post was not intended to make men feel guilty for being men. I love it when men and women can work together for the glory of God. We are different and we complement eachother. I am merely attempting to raise awareness among both men and women that the way we so often view things (the status quo, as you put it) isn’t necessarily right, and perhaps we could work on doing this better. I appreciate your contribution to the discussion.
Anna:
It is clear that the call of God is strong on your life! I hope and pray that you may find the equity that you seek.
My prayers are with you. I know many struggle with this - you have given voice to many through this post: I will try to refer them here to read and consider.
Peace in Christ -
::Matt
I want to comment on this extensively, but I can’t shake the attitude of replying merely for self-aggrandizement, rather than encouraging you as these other fine people have. I don’t know how strongly you’ll take these words, either, since we haven’t known each other for very long.
You inspire me. Greatly.
Blessings.
Thanks for visiting my site Anna…I would love to dialogue with you. The most ironic part of your post for me is that I am a female in the Ministry and also I work in Medical Research at a Children’s Hospital in a Cell Biology Laboratory and I somehow manage this even though I “lack the mental capacity to suceed in the sciences”…go figure. Better yet, my boss is a female M.D. who is the Chief of her Division, has an Endowed Chair, and 3 kids at home; so I would say my standards are set pretty high for even after I am married and blessed with children. Here is the line in the sand for me…I can pursue Medicine and know that if I work hard enough I can have my “dream” a great career and hopefully family, and I will be respected by most of my peers. But, there is a question of will I be content once I get there (and by above example I can get there.) Or, I can pursue Ministry, my true love, and probably have to claw and scrape just to maintain and I may never be truly accepted by my peers or family, but I just might find that perfect joy. So, which of these do I fight for? The answer is not so simple, which is why I respect you so much for tackling this issue and openly dealing with the emotions that arise as you encounter these obstacles.
Finally, I would ask that you do post more scriptual basis my way when you have a chance, and also know that we are out here praying for you to find a way.
I am a woman in ministry, seminary-educated, raising a family with a phenomenal husband, homeschooling, pushing the boundaries of my extremely conservative denomination… I really appreciate your post because it reminds me of the importance of continue to live out God’s calling on me as child of God, wife, mom, minister and woman to the core.
I echo the request to post more Scriptural bases for your position. For example, how do you view Paul’s instructions to Timothy re: “I do not permit a woman to speak in church or to teach men” (not an exact quote, obviously–I haven’t got my Bible at work with me today)?
You and I have never gotten into this subject with each other, and that has been on purpose on my part.
Still, 13 years of friendship aren’t going to suffer over something like this and I really am interested in hearing more of your justifications for your position.
Love you always.
–Angel
Not enough time to comment intelligently, but just wanted to say one thing:
You rock, sister. =)
Amen, Anna, I completely agree with you and feel frustration for both you and Danielle (which will hopefully be diminished in the future). You are amazing and wise and deserve to be in a place where you can minister, which I think will happen because obviously God has a plan for you and will prepare a place for you. I wish I had something more substantial to add… ^..^
I feel so out of the loop since I didn’t have my computer for 3 weeks… we need to catch up sometime!
I thought of this article (again) while blogging today. It’s one of those that rattles around in your brain for a while.
http://micahgirl.blogspot.com/2005/02/blessings-of-ordinary-chaos.html
Anna: Because you’re angry, I think you have not argued your point as soundly as you usually do in your posts. Naturally, this is personal for you. I’ll point out the obvious: Newsweek and the media are pushing agendas, and the poor scholarship of Newsweek’s articles on Christianity in recent years demonstrates that fact.
For instance, you say that because the cross equally redeems men and women, there can be no differences under Christ’s redemptive work in our roles. The second doesn’t necessarily follow from the first. In the Trinity there seem to be distinct roles for the Father, Son and Holy Spirit — why is it impossible that there are different roles for male and female, and not just biologically?
In the Old Testament, we have the great example of Deborah to whom God spoke and whom God chose to lead Israel out of bondage. God chose her to lead men, which says something significant about the heart of God towards women.
In the New Testament, we have Paul, who argued against women in spiritual leadership and for specific roles in marriage. (And despite some misinterpretations of Paul, both husband and wife are called on to sacrifice themselves for the other after the example of Jesus.)
Jesus seems to be silent on the issue. He did not speak about the roles of women, or abortion, or homosexual practices, or slavery — all issues of great importance in modern times. We need to be careful how we interpret that silence.
Within the family, it’s right to say that men have often shirked their responsibilities with the children. On the other hand, advocates for women in the workplace argue that children are unharmed by the absence of their mother — that quality makes up for quantity. Mental health studies on hurting children indicate otherwise.
Within the church, there are many gifted female leaders, pastors and teachers. I have served under and been taught by some. I cannot and will not question the call they have heard from God. But I do hope they are listening to Him, and not the suggestions of society about what is “fair” or “just”.
There is much ambiguity in Scripture on these points, and so they need to be approached with prayer and grace.
Charlie
Hey ppl! Thanks for all the comments. I’ve been chewing on what the “next” post on this topic should be in order to address people’s questions or concerns, and I think finally after a bunch of conversations, I’ve figured out what direction to go in… Now when I’ll have the time to write it is another story. Probably early next week.
Charlie, since you wrote such a long one, I’d like to address a couple of things you said.
First of all, since this is a blog, I’m using it as a conversation tool because I do theology in conversation with the community of God and this allows me to discuss things with people I wouldn’t normally get to talk to. So while I do think through my posts, they aren’t always my final word or complete discussion of the subject. So, while I actually have spent more time researching this post than I normally do, it was on a topic that people tend to question and so I realize that it will need more support.
Second, I never said we don’t have different roles, but I’ll get into that in a later post. I don’t think our differences should affect our titles in ministry, however. I realize that needs to be unpacked, and again another post is coming.
Third, I agree with you that children are harmed by the absence of their mother as well as their father. Never said they weren’t. And again, I’m a single twenty-something that’s trying to figure this all out, mostly because people keep asking me about it, and I’ve got access to resources to study it.
Fourth, I do wonder what man has ever been asked to justify his calling because he might have been doing it to prove a point? I daresay, there are men who are doing things in ministry not out of a sense of calling, but something else. However, it is not assumed that just because they are men, there’s a good chance they have an ulterior motive, but that is often assumed about women, which is what is hurtful.
Good answers (and my apologies for being so long-winded).
With respect to your point four on calling, my experience is as a career missionary where both husbands and wives are considered equal partners in ministry. Each of us is questioned very carefully prior to joining as to our motives, and specifically the reasons we feel called by God to this ministry. Calling is an important question for everyone in ministry, and for everyone who calls himself a disciple of Jesus.
hi anna, thanks for your post on this. i too am struggling in this area. these articles i read last week have helped me so much - they are written by Dr. Gilbert Bilezikian - his book “Community 101″ (i’ve yet to get it in my hands to read it yet) has been highly recommended to me, so while i await the book i found these articles:
http://www.cbeinternational.org/new/free_articles/challenge.shtml
http://www.godswordtowomen.org/bilezikian.htm
i hope you enjoy them as much as i have - they put those passages you’re discussing into perspective for me.
you meant anyone who calls him or herself a disciple, right Charlie?
Yes, that’s what I thought.
Thanks for the links, Bobbie. I’m still hoping to get a chance to actually look at them and get around to a follow-up post, I just haven’t had a chance yet.
Sorry I am entering into this discussion a bit late, but I just discovered your blog this morning. It is so refreshing to see a female seminarian/theologian blogging. I am also a 20-something woman with a B.S. in Biblical Studies and two years towards a Th.M. at Dallas Theological Seminary. Since you mentioned DTS in your post, I thought you might be interested in knowing what my experience was there. On the one hand, I am also a critic of DTS, but on the other, I love my school and don’t want it unfairly criticized. My theology of women’s ministry is still evolving but I am a bit nearer the complementarian side. When I went to DTS, I knew of their policy towards women yet did not want to allow that to stop me from from getting the education I wanted. My goal then was to get a Ph.D. in Old Testament and I wanted a school like DTS with an excellent and rigerous Biblical languages component. So I went. The student body is 25% women, but in the Biblical languages courses and thesis research course that average dropped way, way down to a ratio of 2 women to 25+ men. With that said, I sensed very little discrimination from my professors. Whatever discrimination I might have sensed, came from young, single, white males. In fairness to my professors, I do think it is possible for a person to hold a view based on their understanding of Scripture that women should not hold the position of senior pastor while in practice fully valuing and supporting women–just as it is possible for a person to pay lip service to women’s equality yet in practice show little respect. You have the full right to disagree with DTS profs hermeneutics and conclusions but it is not fair to say that those conclusions necessarily come from a low view of women. In some cases that is true, in others, it comes from their sincere understanding of Scripture. Even if their understanding is wrong, we all are growing in our walk with Christ and ought to give one another the benefit of doubt before we judge the motives of another believer. There are, in fact, a number of woman at DTS training for the pastorate. Further, even though only 25% of the student body is female, two years ago, when each academic department handed out an award to the highest achieving student in that department, every single award went to a women. So, even at DTS, it’s not so terrible an environment for women. Sometime, I want to do a post about this on my own blog but my thoughts still need to mature a little more. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I’ll definitely be back to read more. God bless you in all of your studies and writing.
Sorry, Anna, I already left one insanely long comment, and here I am again. You have really made me think today. Just as you mentioned, there is a huge problem in our society today and even in the church. You may have heard that recent research shows that the results of clinical drug studies on men can not necessarily be extrapolated to women. Frankly, I am suspecting that is true to some extent in theology, even exegesis. As a woman who seems to have a talent in exegesis of all things, I am hit by this reality often. While in a sense my thinking has always been on the “masculine” side and often I have preferred the intellectual company of men, still I am a woman. In the male authored commentaries and textbooks which I love, there is often something missing, while the books billed as “women’s books” seem utterly irrelevant to me. Are you in the same quandary? With God’s grace, perhaps we can do something about this for the next generation of men and women.
This is my first time to be here on your blog. Reading this post made me think of my struggle as a woman in this country.
I have a degree in industrial mathematics and computer science. Now that I’ve finally graduated and despite graduating summa cum laude twice, I feel so insecure and scared because I feel that men who interview me simply think that I am not as good as my male counterpart. Sometimes, I even believe that men are perhaps more intelligent and better than me.
There are moments when I feel really angry at God for making me a woman. I know this is wrong. And many times I wished that I could simply find a husband who can take care of me and somehow fade into the background - raise my kids, take care of my husband. There are times when I seriously just want to be a housewife and not have a career at all. But I know that have to move on and find myself a job. It’s been almost a year now since I graduated, and still I haven’t found a job.
Speaking as a woman who has been called to full-time ministry since I was a young girl, I find the dilemma you’re focusing on a bit beside the point. If I may, I have a few rather disjointed thoughts—I’ve been sick and I can’t keep up my train of thought easily, so please forgive me if I ramble a bit.
1.) The dilemma: As a woman, and a rather outspoken (fire and brimstone, if you like) woman at that, I have struggled for several years with the questions you are asking. God has brought me to some very specific convictions in this regard; but I think He has some more definite things to say in Scripture besides my own convictions:
“A woman shall not teach a man.” Personally, I will not teach a Sunday School class with men because of what Paul instructs. An elder or deacon is to be the *husband* of one wife. (A woman obviously cannot be a husband.) I would never attempt to be, nor attend a church where a woman is a pastor, elder, or deacon. A woman is to remain quiet during teaching and speak to her husband quietly at home. There are times that I WANT to speak in church, but God leads me instead to pray that a man will speak what is burning in my heart that I know is RIGHT and TRUE—and He does.
Retro? Traditional? Organized church? No. I don’t think so. Bibical, and you can’t outdate the Bible, culture, abuse of truth, or no.
2.) The Point: I have spent time in books and in doctrinal studies, in conversations, and in experiences–and I have come to one conclusion regarding “ministry.” It’s not necessarily being a “pastor” or a “teacher.” It’s not being a theologian or a “exegetist.” Ministry is what happens when God calls someone to live His Word and His life to others.
I don’t see people as genders, either—but as people (except, of course for a few glaringly obvious differences like physical appearance and hormones and such :-P). I have ministered to men by challenging them out of their typical modes of thinking by the way I live or speak to cause them to see a God who is a person. I have ministered to women by weeping with them, walking with them, being real with them as Jesus was and has taught me to be. Ministry is a word that has gotten misused and redefined. We don’t have to be in a specific position to minister to people. We, man or woman, minister *where we are* in the life that is given to us abundantly through Jesus Christ (John 17)
WHY do we (any of us, man or woman) minister? Because God has called us. But is that answer enough? Who is this God who has called us? Is the point of our study and doctrine and theology that we change the world and the things we think He doesn’t like about it for Him through our “ministry”? Or is it that we come to know more deeply so we can share more deeply with others this God of the universe whom we have come to know through His Son, Jesus Christ, who is working for Himself the glory of His own Kingdom, in us and in the world?
The point of theology is not theology itself. After a year in a Bible college where I learned all the theology I didn’t know growing up (which was a lot), I still managed to walk away without God. The point of ministry is not ministry itself. I have been “ministered” to for my entire life, but it has resulted in spiritual abuse from “what is right” and the sense that I am not loved, I am a project. The point of theology is the God whom it is about, and the point of ministry is the God for whom it is lived.
The point should not be about the role or the right of the person studying or ministering. It should not be about the old traditions or the new method. The Kingdom of God is about the Spirit of God, at work IN His people, at work THROUGH His people, at work FOR His people.
I’m sick in bed today, but He is working in me. Maybe in writing this post, He’s working through me. But I know that He has worked for me in the past, and will continue to do so in the future, because in all of my study of theology, I could never have forced the faith that He has given me to believe He is faithful.
3.) The Fall: The ground is level at the foot of the Cross, but you said yourself that men and women have different roles. Realistically, and Biblically, we still live redeemed in a fallen world, and men and women are still too prone to blame each other for the mistakes that our first parents made, instead of just looking together at the Man who hung on the Cross and finding Him to be their all.
Think about this one: since the fall (and AT the fall), women have been telling men how to run things, and men have been either standing by a strong woman or standing over a woman who is either dead or rebellious in her heart. Women want to know what God knows. That was Eve’s temptation. Adam’s temptation? Letting his helpmeet run things instead of obeying the voice of the God he knew. You will note that even Deborah was called by God to lead only AFTER Barak refused to take the leadership.
4.) A Call and a Glory: Perhaps our role as women in ministry would be better redeemed in gently challenging and praying for the men of God who are being torn apart by pornography, lust, power, fear, and complacency and you-name-it-what-all-else. Perhaps we could lead by example in seeking God’s face–instead of creating our own system of answers for the men to follow. God gives men an ability to lead that He does not give to women, though women, created as helpmeets before the Fall, can expand and share in ministry as helpmeets walking with Him because of the Cross.
I have experienced this in what He has done with me and my fiancé in a Sunday School class we teach together. I have found this in the ministry team that I founded and co-lead. I have seen this in my relationship with a man who is truly seeking God’s heart, in contrast to my relationship with a man who did not. I have found this in listening to my pastor, in watching my dad grow in his walk with the Lord and begin to pray for me and counsel me as God leads him.
There is a glory in being a helpmeet, and in being a woman. There is a beautiful humility and strength before God I am finding that I never knew existed, and a gentleness that comes from allowing the Lord I trust to direct my steps and work in the men around me to compel them to obedience through His Spirit. I’m not advocating male dominance or browbeaten women. I’m advocating a walk with a God who is beyond comprehension, theology, or doctrine—who created us young man and maiden, old man and child to praise Him and do everything we do (eating or drinking or studying or singing—even off-key!—or falling in love or teaching or anything He created us to do) to His glory (Psalm 148).
Kelly, with all the kindness and respect in my heart, I must point out with some amusement that all of your repression in Church may be leading to some long-winded leakage here online
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thought provoking
As an occasional reader of Anna Aven’s blog I found her recent post on “What does it mean to be a woman?” really interesting. As a man I can’t answer the question but it has significant impacts on how I